The truth must be told about what is happening at the Otautahi Social Centre

sounds like a few misognistic men who would rather see conflict and divisions in the community than admitting to and owning their behaviours - owning their shit! It's the white elephant in the room, it's the can of worms that they don't want opened. "We don't want to go there" has been their most common 'catchcry'.

I heard that the womens support group meetings had to stop at the Centre as certain men refused to respect a request for "womens only space", one in particular who would be there when these meetings were on, intimidating women.

Edith, you defended the alleged rapist for years and did nothing to resolve the problem. It's only now that he and others at the centre have decided to challenge the authoritarian and controlling way in which you ran the place that you've come out against him.

Also, I understand you (or Al) called the police to a dispute outside the center involving members of your "community". What kind of anarchist does that?

I'd call the cops over a rape allegation.

"There was an attempt by some in the community to bring the issues of rape and abuse to light but nothing of substance came of the meetings due to many people being unable to see how wrong it is to continue to allow abusers full rights whilst their "victims" or survivors are basically excluded from community activities."

Including you edith, if the truth must be told.....

I hid the original article because it had a photo of two men and a vague comment that said one was the alleged abuser.

(An AIMC Editor)

Still dragging your dirtly laundry out in the public arenas....IMO Indymedia shouldnt be a communal space to drag ongoing conflicts up on.

Sort your shit out then come tell the world how you sorted it.

please think about how much more we have in common that what separates us.

"A series of professionally facilitated meetings have been set up by the Trust who holds the lease on the building to try to regain some semblance of structure and order as the centre itself had taken on a culture of sexism and bullying"

That's right E-death make sure the white trashathon continues to roll on and on. We need some light relief (apart from the Steve L thing of course) now that there's a National/ Act government in power. Meanwhile the rest of Chch's @ & A/a mileau will continue to organise and work around you & elsewhere in our own projects, groups and collectives while you two and the other three continue to become more and more irrelevant, since all five are you virtually wrote the book on bullying, being self- serving and intimidation & the rest of us find that intensely boring.

Vera Duckworth & the Snugrats.

LOL.
I guess that's what happens when you fail to call a spade a spade.

There's nothing wrong in publishing a piece to counter this, but do it constructively yeah?

I for one think that the center is more trouble than it's worth (and is probably best left closed), but that doesn't excuse or deal with sexist behaviour in anarchist circles — which needs to be done irrespective of a center.

Sorry if this sounds harsh. And Lefty, feel free to add more.

Jared D

it is one thing to make anonymous comment but anyone who makes personal attacks or calls names well being anonymous, that is just petty. jared said it already lets have less finger pointing and more sorting, not a single person involved can have the finger pointed only at them and none of us can be the pointer of said finger. I am sad to see this building which could be so good for Otautahi being so destructive (not that i blame the building you understand) it is just sad. It also saddens me that this seems to be one fucked cycle, ever decreasing in terms of time line and increasing in stress levels.

¨Bearing in mind the centre has been costing the Trust around $2200 to run a month it is not really as easy to run as it all may well seem to some bystanders.¨ can you explain, please, what the last part of this sentence means and who are the bystanders that you are referring to?

Good example of post-modern confusion there.
Neil Postman: "Post-modernism is a form of mental illness."

Thankyou Edith and Al... for having the courage to share the above information regarding what happened at the social center last tuesday and what has happened before and since. As both a witness to the tuesday event (my daughter also witnessed the violence on the afformentioned trustee that tuesday) and an earlier participant (with my daughter and whanau) of the original centre I am happy that these couragous steps have been taken to ensure the best possible outcome for all... to be able to (in the long term) provide, what was oringinally happening, a social 'centre' that is available to all... regardless of belief, association, religion, colour, background or ideology... a hub which is available for eveyone to respectfully enjoy and participate in a joyfull, happy and safe whanau/friendly space...
In my view, regardless of who uses the centre, the centre needs to be 'taken care of' to maitain the 'hub' from which the wider community can come to and use... and measures absolutely need to be (and have been) taken to ensure that intimidation, violence, and abuse of any kind is removed and delt with as swiftly as possible to make the environment safe for everyone...

Thankyou for your time and Im looking forward to bringing my daughter back oneday soon...

Kia Kaha.... Arohatinonui.... A & M

Hey everyone. Can't we please remember why we do the work we do? To help people to be able to live in a better world, yeah?

Revengeful posts on Indy doesn't make things better. Stop the cycle, maintain some integrity and each of us work on our own shit. Indy is not the place for these discussions to happen productively.

Kanohi ki kanohi e hoa ma....

In my opinion this is not an account of what has and is happening, it is an account made by a somewhat delusional individual who, in my opinion, has lost all scene of reality.

(from an outsider)

hey outsider, don't you think it would be constructive to give your version of events then ?
surely that would give others a better perspective,

its quite significant if 'whats so' cannot even be observed in the context of problem solving and dealing with issues. but i suppose thats the core of most conflicts

May I suggest that the Workers PArty be called on to arbitrate in this dispute? They are known as honest and fair people.

I witnessed an assault at the Social Centre, and later I witnessed that man defend his actions. He said it wasn't his fault!

If people are violent, without remorse, they remain dangerous.

This man needs to be excluded from attending the Social Centre, so that it can be a safe place for families, for everyone.

hey out sider ?

interesting your in a position to call someone delusional and claim they have lost touch of reality but your not in a position to post your version of events.

please i'm wondering how did it get to this ?
i'm an anarchist and i would never tolerate domination from anyone, or dishonesty and a lack of respect for women or men,
i've never been to the centre but surely when it was set up there were guidelines ? some priciples agreed upon, and processes for dealing with issues as they came up ?

were these not observed ? did some individuals slowly corrupt this place, was it apathy ?

does anarchy or anarchist necessarily entail honesty and respect ?

all i know is that i'm an anarchist and the people i met from food not bombs were awesome

The last childish comment is extremely enlightening as to where the blame might lie.

indeed they reap what was sown.

distrust, lies, pathetic behaviour and back stabbing....oh the list could go on.......how bout yuo just fuckin stop it all you are doing is creating more pain anger and all that shit! get over yourselves!

well said jared, this is a way forward

The Centre is closed at present and shouldn't be reopened until the structure that Jared talks about is in place.

There is still a huge potential for the Centre being a hub for all sorts of positive projects.
Things like guerilla gardening, food co-ops, seed saving etc are 'so' needed if we are to meet at least our food needs locally.

One thing I'm really keen on is education. Workshops on non-violent conflict resolution, non-violent communication, sexism and patriachy etc.
I've had one person who has 20-30 years experience at 'conflict resolution/restorative justice work' , offer to run a workshop. If there is anyone with experience to share in these matters I hope you could volunteer your knowledge.

I also support the Menshui idea for a national hui for men, on dealing with our sexist patriachal behaviour.
There is so much we need to learn about our relationships with women.

Kerry

It was never my intention to mediate in the OSC dispute. To mediate requires that one be seen as neutral by the parties in conflict, and clearly I was seen as taking the side of the OSC collective (whether or not this was my intention).

I took a position, as a member of the Aotearoa Indymedia (AIM) collective, on whether a proposed Indymedia collective based at the OSC, and involving some OSC collective members, should be excluded from the AIM network. I thought exclusion was no solution to the problems identified by those, including yourself, who were arguing for exclusion. I feel these recent events support that theory, rather than debunking it, because the excluders got their way, and the OSC collective got no support from the Indymedia network in how to collectively face up to past abuse, and more importantly, prevent more abuse.

After leaving the AIM collective, I put some time in behind the scenes, identifying people in both camps who were willing to communicate and work towards a resolution, and putting them in touch with one another. I strongly advised having a co-organized meeting, in a neutral venue, with a skilled mediator. There wasn't much more I could do from Poneke.

I have heard mainly Al and Edith's version of events, and feel there are other sides of the story to be told. I also note that Al and Edith and have changed their tune significantly since I met with the OSC collective in May, when they were calling people "banarchists" for wanting those they now refer to as "perpertrators" excluded from the centre - a provocative term which I now regret having adopted, when I could have used a more straightforward term like 'bullying'. I look forward to hearing their explanations for this change of tack.

This is a small country, and for better or for worse, it has a small activist population. Unless we drop out of activism altogether, and dissociate ourselves from the friends we've met through activism, we are likely to continue bumping into people with whom we've had conflicts over ideology, strategy, tactics or personal style in the past. If we want to make any positive impact on the wider society, we need to figure out some constructive, inclusive, non-violent ways to manage, and resolve conflict. I look forward to hearing some suggestions from you, and others who have been so keen to solve such problems by excluding people, which clearly does not work.

Love and Rage
Strypey

Just to clarify, I meant that 'banarchism' is...

"a provocative term which I now regret having adopted, when I could have used a more straightforward term like 'bullying'"

I didn't think I was pretending to know everything — I clearly don't and I try to make that clear in every comment.

However, I'm an Otautahi anarchist. And I would love to see the federation of all the local anarchist groups in the future. And to do this means the center will have to be addressed. So, I'm keen as to see this sorted, and would love to help — but I feel I don't know everyone or the history well enough to do this.

I'm sorry if I have offended anyone here. I'm happy to be quiet, unless people see some value in my contributions, or think I may be of assistance in some way. Is there an email list?

Cheers
Jared D

"Is there an email list?"

There are too many email lists. IMHO This is part of the problem. I wonder how many people are regular posters here but would not know fellow posters in their own neighbourhood if they saw them on the street? I have always felt that for the net to be a tool of liberation, and community-building, it needs to facilitate face-to-face contact, not be a poor substitute for it.

I will be in Ōtautahi for most of Hakihea (Dec) and I'm willing to meet in person with anyone who wants to talk to me about my positions on these issues. Contact info for those who don't have it is here:
http://strypey.orconhosting.net.nz/contacts

fucken hell, this just gets worse and worse. a
PLEASE, could you guys stop discussing this on an open public forum that is monitored by police and private investigators who spend all day collecting info on all of you. This entire thread is one big shitfight, with lots of personal info, names, mixed in with about thirty completely anonymous comments which are probably from cops or spammers
please shut up, go away, and sort it out in chch in private. or at least away from a public forum that is read by thousands of people every day

A wellington Anarchist

As if cops would be interested in a controversy about male violence and rape culture ...
... ooops

Who is trying to shut up the voices that are crying out against rape, banarchis, oppression, cviolence and male dominated culture?

What the hell is banarchis?