Five arrestees appeared in the Rotorua and Wellington District Courts Wednesday, after Tuesday evening's revoking of Jamie Lockett's bail in the Auckland High Court.
In Rotorua, Tame Iti was denied bail and will reappear on October 24th. In addition, 3 more charges under the Arms Act were laid against him. In Wellington, four arrestees were expected to have a hearing on whether or not their cases would be moved to Auckland, but no decision was reached. All four will reappear on Friday for a bail hearing.
Around 4-5 people in Auckland have been questioned by police on Tuesday and Wednesday, although none have been arrested. It is extremely important that anyone called in for questioning has a lawyer present, and makes no comment whatsoever. There is no such thing as a harmless conversation when it comes to police questioning.
Melbourne, Australia - 30 people gathered outside the NZ Consulate Tuesday morning to voice their opposition to the arrests. [ Report: 1 and 2 (with photos) ]
Christchurch - Around 80 people gathered in Cathedral Square Tuesday evening to send a message of support and solidarity to the arrestees, their families and friends and the people of Tuhoe. [ Flyer ] [ 3 Short Videos ]
Sydney, Australia - Wednesday morning saw 30 people protest outside the NZ Consulate-General. [ Report ]
Rotorua - Around 50 delegates attending an indigenous people's health conference, from the Pacific Basin and North America, marched from the town centre to the District Court for Tame Iti's bail hearing in the afternoon.
Wellington - 200 people attended a demonstration was held today outside the District Court before four arrestees appeared inside. Some people wore stickers stating "terrorist sympathiser". [ Report ] [ Photos: 1 | 2 ] [ Video ]
At this stage, donations can be made to a defence fund organised by Global Peace & Justice Auckland. Identify the donation as being for the defence fund. 38-9000-0099726-00 GLOBAL PEACE & JUSTICE AKLD.
Links: AIMC Feature 1 | AIMC Feature 2 | Remember Security Culture!
Updates
7:51pm - One News reported during their broadcast that Police were currently searching two more houses in Tuhoe country.
Thursday - It now appears that an 18th person was arrested somewhere in the Bay Of Plenty. They were scheduled to appear in the Rotorua District Court Thursday morning. More details as they come to hand.
AoCafe, a popular Tino Rangatiratanga website, has been down since these raids. A comment on AIMC states that "the server which hosts the Manamotuhake and AoCafe websites has been confiscated as part of the raids."
Two houses in in Palmerston North, one in Lower Hutt, one in Wellington, and one at Lake Waikaremoana were searched yesterday.
It appears that 1 arrestee was released on bail in Palmerston North under restrictive bail conditions Wednesday morning. He will appear in the Auckland District Court on November 1st.
In the Wellington District Court yesterday, Michael Bott, lawyer for one of the Wellington arrestees, stated that he had been unable to contact his client in Rimutaka Prison
2:05pm - A Wellington arrestee who is being held in Rimutaka sent his love and thanked everyone for their support. Knowing about the worldwide support they've been getting has made a real difference for those inside.
6:05pm - A house in Taupo belonging to an organic farmer and organiser of EcoFest was raided for 4 hours by 15 Police yesterday.
6:10pm - TV3 News is reporting that around 100 people are currently attending a solidarity meeting in Auckland.
6:34pm - 2 people were in the Rotorua District Court today, both were denied bail. Both have name supression.
Comments
Racial Violence
Does IMC support racial violence?
Re: Racial Violence
Supporting Racial Violence is a Dumb Move
You believe that they must be innocent because they're politically correct -- and even if they're guilty, they're justified.
You've jumped on a bandwagon to protest before you know anything at all. And thus, as more evidence comes out, your entire political movement will be discredited in the eyes of the public because you mindlessly sided with these whackos.
Re: Supporting Racial Violence is a Dumb Move
Re: Re: Supporting Racial Violence is a Dumb Move
Re: Supporting Racial Violence is a Dumb Move
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
There have been reports that they were planning assassinations. Please, how can you be so sure they're innocent?
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
This comment is pure class. I suppose at Clint Rickard's trial you were all supporting him as innocent until proven guilty were you? Does it boil down to:
Pig on trial = automatically guilty
activits on trial = automatically innocent
Waht a delightful concept of 'justice' you all have
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Bull shit.
Boy Scouts are a paramilitary organization that have training camps, uniforms, marching, strictly military origins etc. etc.
ie. Paramilitary training camps does not equal crime.
The weapons in question are for sale "on special" "now only $899" at the "NZ's largest firearm dealer"
ie. Possession of the weapons are not a crime.
You are right in saying that maybe they are guilty of something, but nobody has actually said what yet.
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
In essence they appear to want the right to bear arms and the freedom to use said arms to attack a democratically elected government because they don't agree with it. Sounds awfully similar to the NRA.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Trevor Loudon? Is that you?
In any case: first they came for the Tuhoe. Then they came for the anarchists. Who's next? Exactly how many lefties and activists would you like to see under lock and key? All of them? A mega-Guantanamo near Waiouru perhaps?
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Kurt in Brooklyn
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
yfiifyqn
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Kurt from Brooklyn
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Kurt from Brooklyn
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Supporting Racial Violence is a Dumb Move
You believe that they must be innocent because they're politically correct -- and even if they're guilty, they're justified.
You've jumped on a bandwagon to protest before you know anything at all. And thus, as more evidence comes out, your entire political movement will be discredited in the eyes of the public because you mindlessly sided with these whackos.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
I once again wish to say that I beleive the name given to this article makes me very uncomfortable. Labels are an interesting thing and it seems this one is sticking which to me is very sad. I voiced my opinion at the meeting here in Otautahi where it was agreed to take it off the posters but I was not aware it had been used here as well.
My points made at the meeting are:
1st of all this this does tend to suggest that Tuhoe are the trouble makers here. Another label that Tuhoe can do without.
2nd does anyone understand what the Uruwera mean to Tuhoe and how Tuhoe see it ?
I expressed these views at the hui so it will come as not surprise to those who were there.
This is a national problem for all those who seek to challenge governments and the athourity they use to control us. This is about how an act of parliment that was put in place to make our borders safe (their words not mine) is now being used to arrest, harrass, label, blame, condem citizens of this country who have done nothing but organise themselves. This is about freedom of speech, of freedom of thought, of freedom of caring, of freedom of sharing knowledge and cultures.
Please stop using this title/label. You are rehurting Tuhoe again. Should we be doing that?
One of the clear things that is coming out of this is that there is not a great understanding of how each of us thinks and lives. Tame was trying to change that by including many from outside his iwi and beleive me for Tuhoe that decission was not taken lightly. Tuhoe keep their stuff (for want of a better english word) very close to themselves. They are diffferent to other Iwi. And my last point is that we as tauiwi brought the words Maaori to this country. Tuhoe are a proud, strong, determined iwi. I hope this situation brings all of us together to hear our storys as I know Tame would be thinking.
To all u who have been arrested, to all the whaanau of those arrested, to all those who have been questioned, to all you who have had your houses raided, your communitys attacked, to all those who feel this is an attack on you and your hunuku (family) I send you all aroha me (and) awhi (hugs). This is a deep hurt for us all but for Tuhoe this is just another case of their rohe been invaded again. Bloody hell!!!! When will Tuhoe we allowed to rest. I feel a strong sadness for my Tuhoe whaanau all over the country but mostly here in Otautahi as they try to comfort each other and understand this never ending attack from the kawanagatanga.
I hope we can hear the words of Tuhoe at the rally and march on Saturday in Otautahi.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
And if the Police are right your siding with a group of people prepared to kill and use violence to try and attack a liberal left leaning democracy.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Racist comment
How would you feel if someone said they were sick of blacks?
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Mine.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
They have an inherent distrust of authority even through they benefit from the system. I've always wondered why they don't go to Burma or Iran and fight real oppression - oh wait thats right beacuse they wouldn't last 5 minutes before they're slung upside down with policement brating the soles of their feet.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Dissent will always be criminal if it will be effective in destabilising the state or captalism. The only reason we are allowed to protest and march is because it is not threating to the established heirachy.
But just because something is criminal does not make it wrong; nor does something legal make it right.
Indigenous peoples all over the world are forced to take up arms to defend their land base and right to self determination. Look at what is happening in with the zapatistas and in Palestine.Many of us support this armed resistance overseas so why should that support be any different when the fight is, rightfully so, being bought to Aotearoa?
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
So said wise old Bill Lee (William Burroughs).
Idealism is a beautiful idea. The reality of anarchy is not so pretty. It's great that you are so positive about the nature of man. You must be to think a state without police would be a good idea. I recommend you go to the library and do a bit of travelling.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Who cares about repressive dictatorships brutally murdering and torturing a nation when the snails in happy valley are being brutally oppressed.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
If you did not know this I will explain further; the land sustains all life on this planet and without it we are all fucked.
Any defence of the planet should have everyones full support - that is if you want your self and your family/freinds to live.
That is in no way to disregard the oppersion that is happening to our human brothers and sisters all around the world.
If you look at a lot of indigenous struggle around the world it is as much about defending the land as it is themselves. This is because they are their land; they need it to survive. This connection with the land is something that has been lost from our civilised culture.
Obviously we should do it for mother earth and her inhabitants as well as they do not deserve to die just because the predominant human culture only values money and power.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
What police rapists? (memory loss)
I totally support mana motuhake for the Tuhoe nation. And I believe they are justified in using force to protect that. The entire legal system in New Zealand is based upon the unlawful and forceful taking of this land. How convenient it is to forget that and rave on about our democracy. An imposed political system which suits one group of people very well (middle-class, mostly white) and yet tramples all over the rights and life of others.
Whatever their name - KIA KAHA RA KOUTOU
Re: What police rapists? (memory loss)
Re: Re: What police rapists? (memory loss)
Seriously - can we identify which right-wing blog the talking point "left-leaning liberal democracy" came up on? Because if we find that we can tell where all these dittoheads are coming from, and go and laugh at them where our friends walk free.
Re: Re: Re: What police rapists? (memory loss)
Q. Do you support the use of weapons against other New Zealanders to prove a political point - in this case, Iti and co.This is a hypothetical question, as it did not happen.
The question of whether the police are media are lying about the napalm bomb is a completely different question. If you cannot tease these questions apart and address them face on, with a response, then you are an evasive coward and not willing to address these questions or thick. Which is it? I eagerly await your response. Are you capable of a rational response or only empty rhetoric?
Re: Re: Re: Re: What police rapists? (memory loss)
Re: Re: Re: What police rapists? (memory loss)
I can almost predict your response. No doubt you will go on about vietnam and how napalm was used there against civilians. That is a completely unrelated matter.
stay on point, please.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
It can be listened to online at www.radionz.co.nz/audio/national/ntn/maori_issues2
Comments by Derek Fox
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Typical - cheap shots and no arguments
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
And please continue to post comments of events as they are organised, folks - as soon as we see it we'll add it to the feature!
Solidarity,
Asher
one of the Aotearoa IMC editorial collective
What are the charges? What are they actually accused of?
Looking at all the media available to me has left me confused....
* Possession of firearms? It's not illegal to possess firearms.
* Possession of "military style" weapons? the weapons mention are for sale "on special" at "Guncity" dealer in Christchurch.
* Running Paramilitary training camps? That is exactly what Boy Scouts do and have always done.
* Possession of Molotov cocktails? Thats petrol in a bottle. What you use to run your lawnmower.
So tell me folks. What are the actual charges? What law have these guys actually violated. Surely that should be public knowledge by now? So what _precisely_ is it?
Conspiracy to commit murder
It's not about whether these meatheads have guns or like to run around in camo outfits.
It's about their intention to kill people.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
At last - a cop who can write.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
I actually wonder how anyone can be naive enough to believe something just because some simian in a uniform says it is true.
Lets have a look at the police record shall we. One ex-cop behind bars for rape, one suspeded indefinately for misconduct, another one just convicted of perverting the cause of justice, an independent report taht points to rape and violence being part of general police culture, and another report recently revealed through the Offical Information Act that shows the police are so desperate for recruits they will take people who can't even read.
And you believe them??? Only someone with a "fundamentalist or cult mindset" would be that naive.
Phil
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
IF it is found that groups have been planning to use weapons, including maybe a Napalm Bomb, would you or wouldn't you approve?
I have certainly heard positive affirmation of violence at 128. Usually in the context of suicide bombing. I have also heard fertiliser bombs being discussed. Don't deny it.
The police are not perfect and some of them are idiots. Some of them, like the rapists you refer to, are absolutely vile. But I do not think you can tar the whole police with that brush. I shouldn't tar all 128ers with that brush either. I know many of you are non-violent and interested in promoting worthy causes, even if i don't necessarily agree with your interpretation of world geopolitics, etc. However, you can't deny - one of your number even admitted it in the press - that there is a radical element that would consider violent action, or at the very least, there are people associated with that house who express violent opinions and approve of violence.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
That's a big If. (About the police and the so-called 'left-leaning liberal democracy'.)
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
PS: No, I am not a cop.
You guys should really stop being evasive and engage in arguement, or prepare to be dismissed as nuts.
So long as you refuse to engage with ordinary people and mainstream media, you will be ignored and have no effect on society. You will remain uselessly on the fringe, and some of the issues you are concerned with that really do need to be brought up more often in the mainstream media will get less attention that they deserve. If you really cared about people, this nation, about pluralism, and not simply stroking your own righteous egos, then you would see that.
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Seriously, aren't you worried that we have already dismissed *you* as a nut?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
BUT, If those arrested are guilty of planning violence, they have my wholesale opposition. And fuck those on this site who are willing to engage in endorsement of violence.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Interest: at 11.40 this morning, I was standing near 2 very smartly dressed men on there way to lunch at Springhill...the phone rang," Read Iti his rights and stick to them" was said to the caller!..and dam I didn't get the chance to make conversation.
Five years ago I had a conversation with someone who had gotten involved with Tama Iti and some of his cronies.By all accounts the government had a case to answer, and this group were going to exhaust all legal channels, before resorting to terrorism. This particular group goes back over 20 years and involves a number of learned folk. Part of the program was to pull in radical activists from other organizations.. Perhaps the government knows the case to answer and will have to give up way too much.
On the other hand to target environmentalists, ecologists and organic growers is absurd...they could come for meeee next.! I am eco warrior in a war to save the planet ...facing the worst crisis the planet has ever known...destruction by global warming...it won't matter in 100 years if Iti wore a kilt or I was a vegie grower will it, if we are all swimming..
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
I certainly don't agree with the use of napalm or other violent acts, applying intimidation and fear
for political gain, sadly is something the governments of the world have done for years.
Take a very close look at the direction the USA/UK/Aust are heading, there is far too much surveillance in NZ, the police have way too much power, and get away with far too much crime of their own (PLEASE read Ian Wisharts investigate article aka the Bestiality incident reference:
briefingroom.typepad.com/the_briefing_room/2007/05/media_release_f.html ).
This article was earth shattering, if what was published is false why haven't they sued Ian ? Why didn't NZ ask WTF is going on ? For those who have not read it, it is FAR more serious than a few cops sitting around watching a dodgy movie.
Only a naive fool would think we are not living in a controlled society, I have lost so much respect for authority over the last year, I have no faith in the system any more. With the police scandals the eradication of more of our rights.. non accountability in govt, what has Annette King had to say about these recent events? The complicity within the mainstream media on many issues is astounding.
Some have suggested, on this thread something to the effect of "Were better off than <insert oppressive regime here>".
Well... maybe for now it may seem that way, is covert oppression really better than overt oppression? Is ignorance really bliss? Just keep telling yourself, they NEED to take away our rights to protect us, they need to spy on our phones and internet use for our own good, they need to implant our dogs with microchips, they need to go thru the public trash to make sure you don't put your personal mail in it... the list goes on.
Seeing this raid go down on Monday has had a very chilling affect on my belief of where we stand in NZ, we MUST protect our rights to freedom of speech, and political dissent, If you think we should just blindly trust the powers that be, you deserve to live in a police state, if you are dumb enough to go around killing innocent people for political gain, you belong in jail (or perhaps the us army), I honestly think those held in Wellington are totally harmless and innocent, we MUST NOT let secret court hearings proceed, if we are blind to justice, we have no guarantee that Justice is really being carried out.
Bickering amongst ourselves only helps those who wish to control us, it is time we really analyse what is happening in this country, and ask how many rights we are willing to forgo in the name of our “security”.
I think Benjamin Franklin summed it up pretty well:
"Those who would give up essential Liberty,
to purchase a little temporary Safety,
deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Good on the Maori for wanting self determination, who can blame them for wanting independence from our messed up government.
That's nice.
That's what these 17 terrorists wanted to do.
Re: That's nice.
So what?
And there are plenty of white people who hate whites, on the far left of politics.
Re: So what?
Re: That's nice.
By the way most of us can see you are a troll trying to stir up problems for us all, go away.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
1916 Rua Kenana was arrested & two killed as Police Act on rumours he and his followers supported Germany in WWI. He was convicted in what was recognised at the time by jurists was a travesty of justice.
As for Activists & Bomber starting a hysteria campaign I think a few boys & girls crossed the Activist/Fantasist line.
If Bomber knows anything of Terrorism he shud sit down in front of the cops and spot it out (are the ratings out at the moment).
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
First they came for the Communists,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time there was no one
left to speak up for me.
Target your audience
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Everything is connected- whether YOU like it not
First they came for the Communists,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I wasn’t a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn’t speak up,
because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me,
and by that time there was no one
left to speak up for me.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Yes, I'm sure you have. I think your mates at Stormfront want you to go back, now.
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
You ask how I am sure....it is the last sentence in particular that real puts a nail in it...
"Most Maori want to live a good, peacful life like the majority of NZers"....your a patronising idiot..what the fuck do you know what the majority of maori want.....have you done some comprehensive maori for maori research about what maori want....ummm not!!!....either your pakeha and unaware of exactly how racist your head is or your maori and a station for the oppressor!!!
My moneys on you being pakeha because you presume to know what Maori want, and you are aligning what maori want to fit with the colonial ideal.....what a loser!!!!
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Perhaps you are delusional, I think you should seek some professional advice.
Armed Self Defense is a Human Right!
That said, slef-defense is not violence! Everyone has the right to speak out against injustice as well as to be armed and trained to defend themselves, their communities and their political movements. If the people arrested were engaged in such training - good for them!!!
I have yet to see any evidence put forward that those arrested were doing anything illegal - not that laws can dictate whats right or wrong anyway. Even if the quotes being put out there were not taken out of context (and they likely were), that certainly does not equal "terrorism".
Solidarity from Cascadia!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
We are all thinking of you and strategising on what our next steps are.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Kimble Bent wouldn't have it any other way (civil war) any yank will tell you, FREEDOM comes out of the end of a gun.
A breath of honesty
Planning a race war.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
How will the 'lot' of white men who 'need' to die be killed? When will the exterminations stop?
To borrow from Pastor Neimoller, posted earlier:
First they came for a LOT of white men who were running Aotearoa and needed to die,
Then they came for some Kupapa who needed taking care of as well,
Then they had to deal with the people who thought they had gone to far and spoke out against it,
Then they dealt with those who protested on behalf of the protestors,
Then there wasn't anyone left, except an anonymous little facist posting hate on a website.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
I they want to kill white people, then start with themselves. Where I grew up, in state housing NZ we called them the FBI (Fat Black and Insolent)
What a pack of wankers, lazy good for nothing bastards who take take take, they contribute nothing, they sit around critizing those who have built this country and thats their only contribution to society- they are no different from the coperate raider types they despise.
Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
The originally 4 (now 7) Maori seats were created to disenfranchise Maori (men) who were at the time the major landowners. This deliberate strategy coupled with the land wars contributed to Maori land loss - 66million acres to 2.5 or 3.5mill by 1975. Major invasions of such lands as Waikato, Parihaka and Tuhoe and imprisonment (without trial of some) and state harassment of such as Te Kooti, Rua Kenana, Te Whiti and Tohu have created historic grievances. These, along with modern confications - eg 2004 Foreshore and Seabed Act are not going to go away just because you want them to. Justice delayed is justice denied.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Thats frighteningly similar to what the NRA say. It would appear that you along with a lot of people in this thread want to live in a country where if you don't agree with a democracy just pick up a gun, make some bombs and use violence to get your way.
The hypocrisy in here is astounding. What would be the response if this had been a Neo Nazi group who wanted to establish white rule and were stock piling illegal guns, running armed training camps, making napalm bombs, molotov cocktails and plotting to use these to get their way.
Would you all still be marching against the evil pigs and defending the right of Neo Nazi's to defend themselves and impose their views on others with arms?
"have yet to see any evidence put forward that those arrested were doing anything illegal -"
And what evidence or knowledge do you have that indicates this is just a vast police conspiracy and the people charged are completely innocent?
You are of course aware that throughout the country numerous Judges who have seen the Police evidence have believed it sufficiently strong enough and those charged such a threat to remand them in custody?
I guess you and others have evidence that the Judges are in on it as well?
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
This is something straight out of 1984.
Orwell called it double-speak, and you lot at indymedia seem expert at it.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
It seems at least one judge is able to be impartial, unlike you.
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: meow
Try asking the right questions--that usually leads to more accurate answers. Being diverted like this does dis-empower.
Could this have nothing to do with Maori self determination (or people saying things they have said for years) or activists of whatever stripe that are now in court? Question your basic assumptions, throw them out, then ask why and for whom.
Re: Re: meow
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Police pick the judges now? Don't embarrass yourself any further please.
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out?
Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
You say you've got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We are doing what we can
But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell is, brother, you'll have to wait
Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You'd better free your mind instead
But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't gonna make it with anyone anyhow
Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
Re: Solidarity with the Urewera 17! Free them now!
there is no real evidence
NO MORE EXCUSES
They were going to go to war on their own country. I wonder how they thought they could ever achieve anything this way?
Re: NO MORE EXCUSES
violence aint good but we need to smash the capitalist and kill all the pigs in this fucked up apathetic white middle class cunt-ry...
only then can we begin to talk about real change based on giving everyone a fair go.
Re: Re: NO MORE EXCUSES
it is the only way of solving the problem that this system has posed since 1769. you say you want peace, but to acieve peace we must kill the shitheads who stand in the way
come on new zealand... rise up and destrot those who have imposed your shackles... too long have we taken it up the arse through our attitude of apathy.