Anyone Wanting to Support Prisoners See:
anarchistblackcross.org/abc/abciar.html

do any of these people work for a living, or are all on benfits of one type or another.
It would be nice to hear what their contribution to society is, other than their constant bitching and play acting at how hard done by they are

You can read an example of some of the work that these people do here

Background From Friends Of Wellington “Terror” Arrestees
www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO0710/S00321.htm

jo mcv

Maybe I should be more clear, work for a living, what do they do to support themselves.
Most of us work to support our family, ourselves and the others who can not work due to circumstance- I have no problem with this, we all need a hand up every now and then.

I do have a huge problem to paying taxes, that are used to supply benfits to people, who now find themselves before the courts on very serious charges and who never intend to work at anything other causing trouble

Actually, they're up on very minor charges. There's still no word on if they're going to be charged with anything serious, which is most strange.

The firearm charges they on are not minor, they are looking at serious time if they are convicted.
Still if you can't do the time, don't commit the crime.
If they are arraigned on terrorism charges, then people using this site to support them are making themselves targets for the spooks
If they are convicted, then organizations for which they work <sic> at will also be targeted as fronts for a terrorist organization.
I'm surprised how many of you are treating this as a game, trust me it's no fun standing in the high court with a 10-15 year stretch looming in front of you

They're all being charged with possessing the same individual firearm, how that works I don't know, but basically it means someone had the gun and they each held it for a few minutes, this counts as possession. Does that not seem fucked up to you?

"If they are arraigned on terrorism charges, then people using this site to support them are making themselves targets for the spooks"

You see the agenda here? Intimidation of radical activists. These people would love nothing better than a chilling effect against all radicals. It's not so farfetched to say that that is the agenda behind this whole affair, rather than just the agenda of the paid shill above.

I worked for a very long time , however choose to leave to committ to full time study Im working at a conjoint degree ,double major , so I have no time for work now. I still parent , I have parented for 22 years full time , so approximately half of that time I dedicated to my children , That was still work. jUst after id started work I decided I didnt like the job , so I didnt work...so whos stupid enough , uneducated enough to describe who does what , whats work whats a committment ...YOU...I suppose in your world view...one that extremely limited...are people that WORK better people...what a colonial institulised view of a world...very limited...very shallow....very discrimative...very simple...you need to take a look at yourself...learn a little..

Also...who has the right to say that people that work are better or not...depends on your time of work...also the white collar fraud crime is way more damaging and extensive in this country...that the sudden small petty crime...stop the morphing of numerous issues...understand the issue at hand if youre able...some how I think not...this issue is way bigger than your colonial perspective of life..

Your assertion that the arrestees "never intend to work at anything other causing trouble" is disproved by the list of community activities they are involved in. Some of them may be currently in paid work, others may not. Being unemployed is not a crime, and if people make themselves useful in their communities while they are out of paid work, good on them.

The followers of Martin Luther King and Ghandi, and closer to home the people of Parihaka, were accused of causing a lot of trouble. In a democracy there is a place for organised political movements outside of government. If you don't like that, maybe you should move to China where the free market 'communist' regime are suitably tough on trouble-makers.

Strypey

Some of us believe contributions to society are not based upon digits in your bank account, but your treatment of your envioroment and fellow human beings. Time is better spent defending the civil rights our forefathers spilt their blood for than spending your time in servitude for a consumer driven capitalist state, where everything is designed not to last, to keep the money machine turning and the slaves busy, where now both parents have to work, leaving daycare centers to raise their kids so they can pay the mortgage...I could go on all night, but this is all beside the point.
I would love to know how you contribute to society.

I work for a living and I got raided. I also pay taxes.

raided in palmy.

Your narrow definition of working as a contribution to society shows just how ignorant you are to the realities of this world. Most of the working, law abiding, taxpaying citizens of this country are actually doing more harm than good just by working within and contributing to a system that is inherently unjust and unsustainable. These activists are contributing more to society by educating the people on social justice and environmental issues than you are by merely paying taxes to a government that spends them on the exorbitant salaries of politicians and CEOs of government ministries instead of on health care and education. I reccommend you start reading more than just what Fairfax feeds you

Your narrow definition of working as a contribution to society shows just how ignorant you are to the realities of this world. Most of the working, law abiding, taxpaying citizens of this country are actually doing more harm than good just by working within and contributing to a system that is inherently unjust and unsustainable. These activists are contributing more to society by educating the people on social justice and environmental issues than you are by merely paying taxes to a government that spends them on the exorbitant salaries of politicians and CEOs of government ministries instead of on health care and education. I reccommend you start reading more than just what Fairfax feeds you

just one thing, what does work have to do with what u are sayin, mr anon?

I greatly appreciate people who work, get paid and pay taxes, just as I appreciate those who work, don't get paid and hence don't pay taxes. It's the ones who get paid and don't pay tax that annoy me. My impression is that the annoying ones are as likely to wear suits and buy politicians as to hang out on the back-blocks

Why is there no mention on backgrounds or charges in this article. It really is badly written, for only those who just want to be in on this without any concern for truth (since this is not revealed) or who already know the context would want to form an opinion. If that is Indy's aim, I am very sorry, in numerous ways...but I hope not!

Without any background knowledge about the group and the way they operate (which I find very important information!)I had a look at their website anyway. I must say that it is a good idea to listen more to Maori wisdom (as it says about people being connected to nature, here it was the water), since it states the same wisdom as scientific knowledge (e.g. and foremost, kwantumn fysics) is beginning to reveal to us, the general public as well.
Nonetheless I would start with the following question: what are members of a so-called peacefull movement doing with guns?

What are the rest of the country doing with them?
As per the police website: "There are probably between 700,000 and 1,000,000 firearms in New Zealand."

Police statistics show 8,447 MSSA (military-style semi-automatic) weapons and 3,606 restricted weapons were registered with them as of October this year.

Meaning that between 1/4 and 1/3rd of the country has guns. We have no context as to why they were using the guns, target practise, possum control (they were largely environmentalists), until the evidence is produced I'd say there are dozens of reasons why one might have a gun. And as I've said before in this post, the number of people charged with using the guns exceeds the actual number of firearms captured, which were all captured in the possession of one person. Meaning that just because a particular person held it and the police captured that on film, that is now judged as "possession", which means I've "possessed" many illegal things in my life then.

Thank you both for replying.
I'm just saying, if I read about something that is happening/has happened, I want to know the details/context, so a full coverage in which questions and answers are included. Otherwise it's just poor journalism/reporting.
Especially since I'm from antoher country. I am really interested and if there is injustice and people rise up against this I could be all for that, but if I don't know the facts I can not even begin to form an opinion, if I would, it would be stupidity.
So context like even let's say 10% of Kiwi's own guns mostly to kill overpopulation of rodents and the people arrested have shot their share in their lifetime (just a fictional example)- that would serve the purpose.
If I won't listen to those in power and believe what they tell me without research of my own and then making up my own mind, I would be a hypocrite and stupid to not do this in other circumstances. A free mind needs to exercise in order to remain free!

Doing their bit for new Zealand--shooting a possum

How is this fair? You just deleted my prior comment(27th october)? I thould this site is aiming at letting people know what's going on. So if you're not really clear and someone comments on that you erase it?
What does that say about this site I wonder? And you should!

An idealist at soul, heart and mind

I want to apologize, apparently I opened an old link which didn't show the newer comments. Now would be a good time to disregard my last comment ;) (the one I'm replying too)

An idealist at soul, heart and mind

Message starts from ALF

FREE RANGE LIONS ARE HAPPY LIONS,
LIBERATE ALL DOLPHINS AND FISH,
LET GO ALL BEES,
MEATEATERS SHOULD GET A JOLLY WONDERFUL SMACKING,
THERE WILL BE NO NAVANA UNTIL ALL ANIMALS ARE ROMAING UNINHIBITED, RELESED FROM EVERY WHIP AND CHAINS!!!

Message ends

Bring on the brave new world!!!!!

I don't believe anyone on a benefit should be able to vote. You get parties like Labour effectively buying votes by providing benefits to societies rejects. It's these rejects that are currently involved in these serious charges; I blame the greenies and the labour government for- sponsoring terrorism

If you are taking a benefit i.e, you have your hand out, then you’re not contributing; education, health, infrastructure, treaty settlements, elderly care etc. Why should you have a voice, and why do you have access to social serviced that you have not earned.- it’s sic

As for white collar crime, good on them, if they are smart enough to get away with it. After all you’re too smart to work; the difference is you’re legally allowed to be a parasite.

And for those Maori feebly attempting too embrace the Celtic belief systems, of their most recent forefathers the trick is, abandon the affairs of man .if you want to connect with the universe, our ancestors, the three worlds – it lies in your ability to form a “gees” with that part of your environment that allows you too see- involving yourself in the affairs of man will blind you <sic> “how can you hear what the birds have to say, if all you can hear is people talking”

Flamebait!

"Society's rejects" - smells like nazism.

or those animal rights activists arseholes.

Get a Life! You're brainwashed. I used to be too. Worked in paid work from my teens and still working. Over the past 20 years have been working most of my waking hours. Absolutely stupid thing to do. Single parent but did the hard yards, I regret not spending that time with my kids and enjoying their growing years. I hope that I am now not the self-righteous idiot I used to be like the one above. Life is for living, enjoying, sharing and helping our fellow man - not just to work and pay taxes for childish and hypocritical MP's who are now fighting in the beehive lobby.

If you can't feed them, don't breed them.

It seems the activists are no more than parasites living off the backs of the workers

Who are the parasites and when did you survey to see who living off who , the system was created by those who live off the poor , and the parasites of white collar crime which is far greater in our society now parasite go find another site to be part of , maybe the NZ first or Labour party sites

I could go and join the party that is run by millionaires- err the greens. Or maybe I should hang around the rich lists Niki Hagar-cept he is such a stuck up arsehole : radical royalty, making a living from creating "Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt- err FUD to you.

What white collar crime?- you haven’t got a clue what it even is;. It’s just a slogan shouted by benefit bludgers in an attempt to justify their disgusting abuses of the welfare system

Just because you march up and down the street at the bequest of your wealthy masters does not justify your existence-

The system was created, to keep the labour goverment in power- they are buying votes with benefits- the are responsible for funding radicals and home grown terrorists

You poor sad hater! The poison that spews out of you shows what a lousy life you have. I will pray for you.

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I don't get this name suppression stuff--shouldn't we be shouting those names as we march down the street? Honorig that insane law is teh last thing we should be doing. Does any body have the courage to list them so I would have a list to start shouting? Names to post on placards on our motorways and round-abouts...If I am going to get charged for saying a name, then bring it on.

And if family and friends camped out in front of where these 17 are held, and if some even announced a hunger strike...this would begin to be resolved at a pace other than that set by the police or court authorities and the press, both domestic and foreign, would see that this is far from a 'terror' operation.

"'' What white collar crime"??

wow what an idiot. DowAgroSciences has commited lots of white collar crime and people DIED from it and continue to DIE from it.

Again what white collar crime, you are being evasive- what has DowAgroSciences done that is criminal and who has died.- or are you just chanting slogans that have no substance in an attempt to justify your contemptuous existence

I see that the wellington hospital trust is reduced to begging- yet if the money was ripped from those "bloody racist filths" hands then we would not have shortages of funding.

The government keeps holding back monies so they can pay off lazy radical scum and in doing so buy votes

taxes do not go to dole bludgers (people that need help), taxes go to central banks to pay interest on money loaned to your gutterment, it is known as Slavery, usery. You have the very same JEWISH banking "system" as amerikkka.

Taxes do not go to dole bludgers (people that need help),

Taxes are taking the food out of the mouths of hard working, honest Kiwis’, who struggle everyday just to make ends meet. How dare the government support benefit bludgers like Tame, it is a crime against society. His own mother says he has never worked, all the rest of the family have good jobs but him. How can you be so fat, have children etc and not have any means of supporting yourself- it is an outrage, a fraud perpetrated against the workers.

It’s a shame you radical, narrow minded hypocrites don’t cotton on that your part of the problem and nothing to do with a solution- you should help save the planet and kill yourselves

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at least one member of the 17 from wellington has been moved to Auckland, without notification to family or friends. the first that was known by anyone of the transfer was when family and friends arrived at the prison for visits only to be told of the move. Calls had been made earlier to the prison to book visits for this person, no mention of transfer was made at that time despite the fact the the person had already left the prison. We can only assume that not everyone at the prison was aware of the transfer

Don't feed the Trolls. Especially the one in the comments above. He sounds like he's bursting at the seams with irrational hate. I hope one day he can find love and compassion in his heart and see what is really important in life.

"Troll" was very kind of you - and they definitely need ignoring - its possibly small penis syndrome or something like that!

This is plain dull! www.caff.org.nz is much more important!

I'm extremely pleased to see that Peter Williams QC is now being engaged to participate regarding the concerns in Ruatoki and also the arrests , what another brilliant lawyer ( alongside , Annette and Moana & others.) He has a recent article in Scoop regarding this. Anyway he is also involved in Howard League Society ( President ) ( www.howardleague.co.nz & www.criminalbar.org.nz ) Awesome site for information re Penal insitutions etc.... Also www.corrections.govt.nz is good to get an understanding around the policies & procedures in those nasty institutions , and what they should adhere too!!! Finally , my partner was the first on Electronic bail for Hamilton City & Waikato , at the end of the term , was second longest serving , really happy to support whanau that end up on this option , it was a nasty process to get through the application but worth iT!!it had its own pressures. My email for honest , genuine persons , Please respect :ajb10 (at) waikato.ac.nz

RE:
Stalin Fart
Slime Shitter
Drone Hive
Nazi Land

Dear Mrs Slime Shitter,

things have gone from bad to worse since you were elected to govern naziland in November 1999. You attempted to appease the US by accepting their proposal that naziland adopt 'anti-terror laws' after 9/11. This policy was immediately enacted to prosecute Bruce Hubbard who, 6 months earlier, had posted an email to the US embassy in Wellington stating US involvement in international terrorism and the establishment of 72 capitalist dictatorships.

It wasn't long ago you referred to yourself as a 'social-democrat', yet I am convinced this in untenable in light of your actions since November 1999. Your reluctance to ensure a democratic process for the 17 arrested on October 15th exposes your desire not to annoy white middle naziland right before elections. Your desire to remain Slime Shitter reflects the ambition for power you have had since you were 15 years.

Mrs Stalin Fart - all you have effectively done since November 1999 is ensure that wealth is concentrated in the hands of a few while shrouding your policies in a veil of democracy. Your latest inactions however diminish your ability to hide the repressive measures you never stopped using as the majority of naziland - those who have less to lose - begin to see your role with greater clarity.

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